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Posted by Bill S on May 4, 2007 at 6:40:03 pm EDT
In reply to Stephensons? posted by Carl on April 7, 2007 at 11:04:06 am EDT

calamity -
I think your lead comment in your last post illustrates the point very well - "These 2 culled comments (see above) completely reinforce my gut feelings:..." You have selectively chosen the negative comments and omitted the ones contrary to your "gut feelings". In science, we call that "selection effect" - pick the data that supports the preconceived conclusion.

In 12 reviews posted to Trailspace, 6 are 5 star (top positive rating), 5 are 3.5-star (one particular tent the 2R which got 2 of the 5-star ratings), and one 2-star. That's pretty positive. By comparison, of 78 reviews of North Face tents, only 2 reviews rated any TNF tents as 5 star. 8 of 96 reviews of Mountain Hardwear tents were 5 star. 16 of 108 Sierra Designs tents got 5 stars. So it looks like Stephensons gets a higher level of enthusiasm by users than other top companies. Except no review for SD or MH was lower than 3 stars, and for TNF 2.5 stars. You really have to read the reviews closely, though, because sometimes the flaw is pretty important for a particular use, and sometimes it makes no difference for the use to which it will be put.

I have seen many situations and much gear where one or two negative experiences completely sours someone on an excellent product, and comments from that person "reinforces my gut feelings" for another person. The question from Scruggs is very relevant to this - "Are there are any other small companies that make quality products but fly below the mainstream radar?" The answer to Scruggs is, as Steve said, yes, there are lots of small companies making quality gear. Directly relevant to the main set of posts in this thread, many of those companies are run by people who are somewhat eccentric, somewhat egoists, and often feisty. Dana Gleason is such an example. When Dana Packs got too large for him, he sold the company to K2, which went directions he did not approve of. He then started Mystery Mountain. About this time, I sat down with him to discuss Mystery Mountain packs, but made the mistake of bemoaning his sale of Dana Packs, which resulted in a long tirade against the new owners and the direction they were going, along with why his new company was making the world's best packs (they are good, in fact, if a bit quirky), and the rest of the world was out of step. Jack Stephenson was one of those eccentric individuals, and to a large extent so is his son.

In climbing gear, back in the 1960s, there was a guy by name of Bill Feurer, who acquired the nickname of The Dolt. He is the person that Dolt Tower on the Nose route up El Cap is named. Nice guy, and brilliant in engineering and inventiveness, but a lousy businessman and prone to inventing weird things (like the Dolt trailer) and doing crazy things on climbs (hence the nickname Dolt). His designs of climbing gear got copied and incorporated into a lot of climbing gear that is around today. Because people were copying his gear, he became more and more paranoid (literally, in the medical sense), ultimately committing suicide.

Ray Jardine is another example of a very inventive person who started his own company, although he sold off the rights to Friends (the original successful camming device), then went on to invent The Ray Way of extreme ultralight camping. To say the least, he is pretty fanatical and eccentric, and can get quite feisty if you get critical about his approach to things. Friends are now produced by Wild Things, and GoLite has the rights to much of the RayWay ultralite gear and clothing designs.

You can find similar examples among musicians (right, Steve? No, no, no, Steve, not you of course ;D) and other artists. Feistiness seems to be a characteristic of inventive people. So I would say that confrontational incidents are not the way to judge gear, or artistic merit. For gear, the question is how does it work in the real world situations for which it is designed. In music and art, judge the product, not the artist. Obvious examples are Beethoven and Glenn Glould in the classic world, Rembrandt and Picasso among painters, Doc Watson among country/folk artists (I saw him throw his guitar down in the midst of a concert once because someone misadjusted a mike).

Getting back to Stephensons in how it works - most of my personal experience, and that of most people I know who have and have used Stephensons tents and sleeping bags extensively is overwhelmingly positive. Having a tent, made by anyone, that comes apart in a storm is not that surprising. As I previously noted, I have seen TNF tents come apart, as well as other top brands. I have also seen cheap tents that surprised me by standing up in conditions that I would have been sure they would fail. But the vast majority of TNF, MH, SD, and other top brands that I have been in or camped near to in storms in places like Denali, the Mexican volcanoes, the Cascades, Sierra, Rockies, Alps, White Mountains (specifically the Presidential Range), and other places have stood up quite well. All the Stephensons tents I have seen in such situations have stood up as well.

One of the quotes you included and re-quoted refers to a Stephenson coming apart at Camp Muir. As it happens, I have seen one and know of a couple of North Face, one Sierra Designs, and one Bibler tent that came apart in that same location. I have also gone through one storm where two people camped right next to me had their identical tent to mine start ripping a seam while mine stood up just fine. Before condemning all products from any company, I would have to know what the conditions really were and how the tent was pitched. How old was the tent, how many days in the sun at high altitude, how many windstorms had it been through, how had it been cared for (packing, drying after trips, storage at home, etc)? As I said before, that makes a huge difference in survivability of the tent. It's not the personality, ethnicity, race, color, religion, political affiliation, or any such thing that makes the difference. It is simply how it holds up in the situations in which I use it. Again, 4 of the 6 quotes you had in your earlier post said their Stephensons tents stood up. And remember, people with bad experiences will complain loudly and post diatribes, while most people with good experiences won't take the time to post. It is far easier to tear down than to praise.

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