GRIGRI ADVICE

5:20 a.m. on April 29, 2002 (EDT)
(Guest)

Johnny Stuart, Secretary, Moray Mountaineering Club.

Has anyone had any experience using GriGri`s with beginners. We practice on 12-meter high sea cliffs in the evenings and the beginners are always keen to practice, but leading with a beginner belaying, can be a bit unnerving. If the newbie knows the basics of belaying, is the GRIGRI a good safety backup. I`ve heard a few story

10:30 a.m. on April 29, 2002 (EDT)
0 reviewer rep
408 forum posts
Good tool...

Quote:

Has anyone had any experience using GriGri`s with beginners. We practice on 12-meter high sea cliffs in the evenings and the beginners are always keen to practice, but leading with a beginner belaying, can be a bit unnerving. If the newbie knows the basics of belaying, is the GRIGRI a good safety backup. I`ve heard a few story

9:08 a.m. on April 30, 2002 (EDT)
(Guest)

Grigri: static vs. dynamic belay, any comment? NM

I don't have time right now, perhaps someone can make additional comment on this topics. For example, you may not want to lead with a solidly anchored Grigri belay.

9:59 a.m. on April 30, 2002 (EDT)
(Guest)

Correction: Grigri: static vs. dynamic belay, any comment?

Oops, once again, my fingers wiggle faster than my brain.

Correction: If you are leading, you don't want to use a solidly anchored Grigri belayer.

10:48 a.m. on April 30, 2002 (EDT)
(Guest)

a.k.a. scott

When I started to teach my wife to climb, I coughed up the $70 for one. It turned out to be a great piece of equipment for her to learn belaying on while I was climbing.

Just be sure to set it up correctly before you lead off.

11:36 a.m. on April 30, 2002 (EDT)
37 reviewer rep
747 forum posts
Re: Correction: Grigri: static vs. dynamic belay, any comment?

Quote:

Oops, once again, my fingers wiggle faster than my brain.

Correction: If you are leading, you don't want to use a solidly anchored Grigri belayer.


When I attached my 85 pound belayer to an anchor [using a gri gri], I made sure that she had slack in the anchor rope(afterall she is going to be yanked of her feet and into the air if I fall) - 85 pounds jerking 2-3 feet off the ground is sort of dynamic don't you think?
Jim S (;->)
YMMV

2:06 p.m. on April 30, 2002 (EDT)
(Guest)

a.k.a. Chris Jain
Re: Correction: Grigri: static vs. dynamic belay, any comment?

I seem to remember reading that even when the grigri belayer is unanchored the shock on the top piece is considerably higher than if the belayer had been using an ATC...

Quote:

Quote:

Oops, once again, my fingers wiggle faster than my brain.

Correction: If you are leading, you don't want to use a solidly anchored Grigri belayer.


When I attached my 85 pound belayer to an anchor [using a gri gri], I made sure that she had slack in the anchor rope(afterall she is going to be yanked of her feet and into the air if I fall) - 85 pounds jerking 2-3 feet off the ground is sort of dynamic don't you think?
Jim S (;->)
YMMV

3:09 p.m. on May 1, 2002 (EDT)
(Guest)

a.k.a. Paul, Paul R, Paul R., Paul Raphaelson, PR
Re: Correction: Grigri: static vs. dynamic belay, any comment?

An ATC will start to slip at about 600lbs of tension (with a normal single rope, not wet or iced, with one carabiner). This means that for every foot the rope slips, the system uses friction to dissipate 600 foot-pounds of energy. That's a lot. (an 85lb belayer getting yanked 3 feet straight up dissipates only 255 foot-pounds of energy. also for comparison, a hip belay starts to slip at around 250 lbs tension, so a lot of rope is likely to smoke by if you hold a truly hard fall and are well anchored. Be prepared).

A gri gri won't start to slip until around 2000 lbs of tension, which is basically impossible to generate. So you can think of the gri gri as being completely static.

Quote:

I seem to remember reading that even when the grigri belayer is unanchored the shock on the top piece is considerably higher than if the belayer had been using an ATC...

Quote:

Quote:

Oops, once again, my fingers wiggle faster than my brain.

Correction: If you are leading, you don't want to use a solidly anchored Grigri belayer.


When I attached my 85 pound belayer to an anchor [using a gri gri], I made sure that she had slack in the anchor rope(afterall she is going to be yanked of her feet and into the air if I fall) - 85 pounds jerking 2-3 feet off the ground is sort of dynamic don't you think?
Jim S (;->)
YMMV

7:43 p.m. on May 1, 2002 (EDT)
37 reviewer rep
747 forum posts
Tiny fingers hold no ATC brake

In my original statement (in the thread about two climbers of different weight)I pointed out that the 85 pounder in no way had the finger strength to belay - not with an ATC or anything that I know of besides a gri gri. You guys with bronze fingers can argue about dynamic belays, but when ya climb with tiny people you had better not have your life dependent on their ability to hold ontp the rope with their hand. Besides if you use 8.5mm rope it slips more easily...
Jim S

9:26 p.m. on May 29, 2002 (EDT)
(Guest)

Re: Correction: Grigri: static vs. dynamic belay, any comment?

It seems to me that the net effect of the two scenarios is very similar in terms of dissipating forces.

1. the rope slips through an ATC (and all the gear) while the belayer is tied off tightly, thus dissipating some force. dynamic belay yes, but with some risk of being dropped, if belayers hand is burned or they are otherwise unable to hold onto the rope. also they are less able to dodge rockfall since they are tied in tight.

2. the rope pulls the lightweight belayer (who is tied off with 2-3 feet of slack) off the ground, and while it does not slip through the gri-gri, it does slip 2-3 feet through all the gear as the belayer is lifted off the ground. this is probably more than it would slide through the ATC in the first scenario, so i would suggest that this setup might actually provide a comparably dynamic belay with much less risk of being dropped.

i haven't used gri-gri's all that much, so i'd be curious to see if anyone can back up (or shoot down) my theory with practical experience or actual data.

comments?


Quote:

An ATC will start to slip at about 600lbs of tension (with a normal single rope, not wet or iced, with one carabiner). This means that for every foot the rope slips, the system uses friction to dissipate 600 foot-pounds of energy. That's a lot. (an 85lb belayer getting yanked 3 feet straight up dissipates only 255 foot-pounds of energy. also for comparison, a hip belay starts to slip at around 250 lbs tension, so a lot of rope is likely to smoke by if you hold a truly hard fall and are well anchored. Be prepared).

A gri gri won't start to slip until around 2000 lbs of tension, which is basically impossible to generate. So you can think of the gri gri as being completely static.

Quote:

I seem to remember reading that even when the grigri belayer is unanchored the shock on the top piece is considerably higher than if the belayer had been using an ATC...

Quote:

Quote:

Oops, once again, my fingers wiggle faster than my brain.

Correction: If you are leading, you don't want to use a solidly anchored Grigri belayer.


When I attached my 85 pound belayer to an anchor [using a gri gri], I made sure that she had slack in the anchor rope(afterall she is going to be yanked of her feet and into the air if I fall) - 85 pounds jerking 2-3 feet off the ground is sort of dynamic don't you think?
Jim S (;->)
YMMV

8:23 a.m. on July 13, 2003 (EDT)
(Guest)

Re: Tiny fingers hold no ATC brake

Quote:

In my original statement (in the thread about two climbers of different weight)I pointed out that the 85 pounder in no way had the finger strength to belay - not with an ATC or anything that I know of besides a gri gri. You guys with bronze fingers can argue about dynamic belays, but when ya climb with tiny people you had better not have your life dependent on their ability to hold ontp the rope with their hand. Besides if you use 8.5mm rope it slips more easily...
Jim S


You should never use 8.5 mm rope with a grigri. it is designed for 10 - 11mm rope only. you are way outside the manufactures specs.

September 17, 2014
Quick Reply

Please sign in to reply

 
More Topics
This forum: Older: Fun with GPS Newer: FS: TNF Mountain Jacket MAD CHEAP
All forums: Older: The Sierra's Hilton Lakes and Stanford Peak Newer: Goretex material on ebay