Thermarest sizing variability

8:40 a.m. on April 30, 2012 (EDT)
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I bought a thermarest ridgerest solite yesterday. I tried the demo mattress at the store and the length was ok. Of course since it's 72inches long and I'm 71 inches tall. But when I arrived at home I unpacked the brand new RR and triend it and it was to short. I measure it and it was 69 inches. An error of 3 inches. That's outrageous. Now I have to bring the mattress back at the store. It will cost me gas+parking spot. I don't know you had any such experience but I warn you to try the actual thermarest mattress that you want to buy and avoid buying it on the internet.

I also check the weight : 12.7 oz instead of 14. That's too much so now I'm wondering about the R-value stated. In any case It's the first time I buy a thermarest and my first impression is not really good. Unfortunately, outdoor shop really sucks here in quebec and there is no alternative to thermarest.

11:18 a.m. on April 30, 2012 (EDT)
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Maybe double check the model and style on the labeling to that of the floor model.

Maybe the floor model is labelled incorrectly.

Maybe the dimensions on the one you bought match that as on its' packaging.

11:58 a.m. on April 30, 2012 (EDT)
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Callahan said:

Maybe double check the model and style on the labeling to that of the floor model.

Maybe the floor model is labelled incorrectly.

Maybe the dimensions on the one you bought match that as on its' packaging.

 Don't understand what you mean. It's labelled 72 inches on their website :

http://cascadedesigns.com/therm-a-rest/mattresses/trek-and-travel/ridge-rest-solite/product

On their tag it's also 72 inches. So it has to be 72 inches. An error of 0.5 inches i can understand. But 3 inches that's unacceptable. 

1:40 p.m. on April 30, 2012 (EDT)
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Does it look trimmed?  Maybe it was purchased, cut and returned?

Otherwise, you have an anomoly.  A shorter, lighter pad.  Of course if it was me, I wouldn't be complaining because I trim mine down anyway.

Just return it.

2:01 p.m. on April 30, 2012 (EDT)
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I think Callahan was wondering if there was a shorter version (there are three sizes) and if you received one. I thought the same thing, but I looked up the sizes and saw none were close to what you got. 

I think just swap it out for a non-defective one at the retailer, or call cascade designs. One or both of them will replace it with the proper size. 

2:56 p.m. on April 30, 2012 (EDT)
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Family Guy said:

Does it look trimmed?  Maybe it was purchased, cut and returned?

Otherwise, you have an anomoly.  A shorter, lighter pad.  Of course if it was me, I wouldn't be complaining because I trim mine down anyway.

Just return it.

 It's not trimmed. It's really brand new and shining. 

I have an anomaly but it seems i'm not the only one apparently. It seem TAR put more money on marketing than on quality control which is understandable.

I will return it. But it take me 1 hours to go there  (so two hours wasted) and the gas is expensive. If the shop was just next to my house i wouldn't mind of course. 

I think i will return it and buy another brand.

I don't mind to have a lighter pad of course, but for the price paid and Made in usa (it's an expensive foam pad after all) i was expecting something top notch without any defect.

6:32 p.m. on April 30, 2012 (EDT)
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Brumo sounds like you got a mismatched item.There really is no reason not to keep the item after you exchange it.All manufacturers make mistakes. What makes them a good compnay is the exchhange  with very little problems and they do have great products..

8:01 p.m. on April 30, 2012 (EDT)
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The Ridgerest Sol has that name printed on both ends (and it is about 3" high) . Do you have that ? If not I assume that someone has trimmed the mat...

 

 Franco

8:12 p.m. on April 30, 2012 (EDT)
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 I have it.
Nobody trimmed the mat.

But i think i'll cut it anyway. I met 3 other person on french forum who had similar issues with their thermarest

8:18 p.m. on April 30, 2012 (EDT)
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I'd love to see a picture of that mat with a measuring tape next to it...

Franco

8:21 p.m. on April 30, 2012 (EDT)
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 that may be difficult cause I need a hand for that+ take a pic of the whole pad neat enough to see the numbers may be problematic.

but I can take a pics of both end and i can assure you that it is 69 inches instead of 72. I don't see why you don' t believe me? Why should I post a thread?

8:38 p.m. on April 30, 2012 (EDT)
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Because they are cut by the thousands by the same machine and I have never come across one single comment from any user (before you) saying that theirs had shrunk or was shorter than stated. So there is something really odd about the length and weight...

 Franco

8:46 p.m. on April 30, 2012 (EDT)
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Maybe it's because most people don't bother to weight and measure their gear. Again other users measured their Solar at 70 inches. And a lot of UL backpacker had a weight issue. They didn't mind of course cause it was lighter than the specs stated.

8:46 p.m. on April 30, 2012 (EDT)
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Much lower

1:33 a.m. on May 1, 2012 (EDT)
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Do you have by any chance a link to the comments in the French forum ?

(I can read French...)

Franco

10:27 a.m. on May 1, 2012 (EDT)
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Franco said:

Do you have by any chance a link to the comments in the French forum ?

(I can read French...)

Franco

 I would be glad to do so, if i wasn't so suspicious about your strange behavior. First, for whom are you working for? 

5:45 p.m. on May 1, 2012 (EDT)
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not sure about the logic there. What difference does it make if I work or not for Thermarest ? You either have that info or you don't ... As I already hinted at, at the time of manufacture all those mats are press cut  by machine not by hand. So they are all 72 " or they all would be 69" ...

Franco

6:56 p.m. on May 1, 2012 (EDT)
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How are they measured on the machine? If they are measured with a wheel similar to a surveyors wheel. Couldnt the wheel slip a little and show a longer measurement than actual length. We used a machine to cut small foam pads, padding for the backrest in a kayak. Sometimes for no apparent reason we would get a few considerably shorter ones. A slight scuff where the wheel was and a good eye finally solved the mystery. On our machine the wheels were on one bar and they moved the material and measured the distance by the number of revolutions. If they are having a similar problem, they could create pads with random, but shorter lengths. Im gonna go measure all my foam pads. Haha

Mark

6:58 p.m. on May 1, 2012 (EDT)
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7:27 p.m. on May 1, 2012 (EDT)
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As a matter of fact I am very close to A Thermarest when I sleep on one , the Neo Air of late, however I get deeper and more meaningful relationship with my  Exped Downmat in winter. Oddly I don't even like the Ridgerest simply because it is as big as my all pack and not at all comfortable for me (side sleeper mostly) The point here is that the RidgeRest looks like this :


ridgerest.jpg

 now how can you get that exact pattern with the Ridgerest writing at either end AND a different size ?

 Franco

7:32 p.m. on May 1, 2012 (EDT)
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Franco said:

As a matter of fact I am very close to A Thermarest when I sleep on one , the Neo Air of late, however I get deeper and more meaningful relationship with my  Exped Downmat in winter. Oddly I don't even like the Ridgerest simply because it is as big as my all pack and not at all comfortable for me (side sleeper mostly) The point here is that the RidgeRest looks like this :


ridgerest.jpg

 now how can you get that exact pattern with the Ridgerest writing at either end AND a different size ?

 Franco

You didn't asnwer the question but anyway.

 Apparently you think i'm a dumbass. My sleeping pad look exactly like that. Did you measure yours?

I'll try to take a picture of mine asap. 

7:47 p.m. on May 1, 2012 (EDT)
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Don't bother about the pics, just the link to the "French Forum" will do. Maybe they have pics there.

Franco

8:40 p.m. on May 1, 2012 (EDT)
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I know Franco and no, he does not work for Cascade Designs or MSR or any related company.

He is trying to help here.

8:41 p.m. on May 1, 2012 (EDT)
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Hi Brumo - I've noticed small variations in size in several Therm-a-rest products, closed cell foam and inflatable.  Since I'm short and pack light, none of these small variations in size have been a big deal for me.  I also trim my ridgerest pads, so few of them now extend beyond my knees!

If you're not inclined to drive back to your retailer, you could contact Cascade Designs (the parent company of Therm-a-rest) and take it up with them.  There is always the possibility that they could provide you pre-paid mailing materials or an account number.  Some might argue that 3 inches is an insignificant error, but I suppose this could mean the difference between frostbitten toes or not.

9:36 p.m. on May 1, 2012 (EDT)
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IMG_0379.jpg

I apologize it is actually 68 inches. I was sloppy the first time i measured it. To see it download and zoom in

9:38 p.m. on May 1, 2012 (EDT)
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4 inches is not what i call a small variation. Suppose you try a pair of shoes in a shop, order a 12 and get a 11 instead, would you be happy. If shoes manufacturer can do it i don't see any reason why tar cannot do it. 

10:25 p.m. on May 1, 2012 (EDT)
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well I am definitely intrigued now. Of course I can't see those numbers, any chance you can e mail me the full size pics at franco dot darioli at gmail.com ? Franco

10:35 p.m. on May 1, 2012 (EDT)
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Franco I expanded the photo and it is coming in at 68.5". If you click on the photo it will take you to the photo on Brumo's page, then look in the lower left of the page you will see View/download Original...

At this point it will expand the photo to full size. You will notice that your cursor has now changed into a circle with a + in it.

Put this over top of the area you want to view larger and left click on it.

10:36 p.m. on May 1, 2012 (EDT)
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Franco said:

well I am definitely intrigued now. Of course I can't see those numbers, any chance you can e mail me the full size pics at franco dot darioli at gmail.com ? Franco

Download the pic and zoom in. It's not super neat but you can see the numbers. At least i can see them and my girlfriend too. it is the actual pictures. I just crop to hide the increase in entropy caused by my daughter.

11:00 p.m. on May 1, 2012 (EDT)
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Ah, thanks I am used to Photobucket not direct upload. Well I'll be damned.

I still can't understand how that could be but maybe someone will have an explanation...

Franco

11:08 p.m. on May 1, 2012 (EDT)
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On the french forum, someone measured his two solar at 70 inches and another one measured a Xlite small at 45 inches instead of 48. But the worst is this :

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=63495

Other people report similar issues with the neoair range on other forum.

11:17 p.m. on May 1, 2012 (EDT)
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In any case i think I'm done with TAR.

11:33 p.m. on May 1, 2012 (EDT)
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Just one thought Is it still 20" wide ?

For the record I have had several brands of mats. Only one from POE (they have had a lot of bad publicity recently...) but about 10 years later still works (it's a loaner or for me when I use a top bag) I have had two Exped. One leaks (slowly) and there is no way I can find the hole/s . The newer one also has a very slow leak but good enogh for the night. (no, it  is not the hot air thing) One Thermarest failed years ago (was replaced at no charge)  , I now have the Neo Air and a ProLite 4 , both work well. I had an Artiach that failed the replacement worked and I think is still OK now (I gave that one away)

 Franco

12:36 a.m. on May 2, 2012 (EDT)
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I wonder how closed cell foam reacts to heat?  I mean, any chance that extreme heat can shrink it?  Maybe in the shipping or how it was stored at some point may have affected the length.  So like Franco, I would be interested in the width.

With respect to the inflatables, such as the NeoAir, the dimensions are correct.  Deflated.  Just a minor consideration...; )

1:11 a.m. on May 2, 2012 (EDT)
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looking at the R tests at BPL it appears that Thermarest use the dimensions (and R value)  of the mat inflated at 80%. You get more insulation at 100% but less space to lie on

Franco

6:35 a.m. on May 2, 2012 (EDT)
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Franco said:

Just one thought Is it still 20" wide ?

For the record I have had several brands of mats. Only one from POE (they have had a lot of bad publicity recently...) but about 10 years later still works (it's a loaner or for me when I use a top bag) I have had two Exped. One leaks (slowly) and there is no way I can find the hole/s . The newer one also has a very slow leak but good enogh for the night. (no, it  is not the hot air thing) One Thermarest failed years ago (was replaced at no charge)  , I now have the Neo Air and a ProLite 4 , both work well. I had an Artiach that failed the replacement worked and I think is still OK now (I gave that one away)

 Franco

it is 20 inches wide indeed

2:26 p.m. on May 2, 2012 (EDT)
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Franco said:

Just one thought Is it still 20" wide ?

For the record I have had several brands of mats. Only one from POE (they have had a lot of bad publicity recently...) but about 10 years later still works (it's a loaner or for me when I use a top bag) I have had two Exped. One leaks (slowly) and there is no way I can find the hole/s . The newer one also has a very slow leak but good enogh for the night. (no, it  is not the hot air thing) One Thermarest failed years ago (was replaced at no charge)  , I now have the Neo Air and a ProLite 4 , both work well. I had an Artiach that failed the replacement worked and I think is still OK now (I gave that one away)

 Franco

 What bad pub for POE? I've had a great experience with my pad... 

3:55 p.m. on May 2, 2012 (EDT)
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 What bad pub for POE? I've had a great experience with my pad... 

There was some in the UK, problems with the sleeping pads that is. We have, however, used one for a few weeks with no problems. They have changed their name to Hyalite now, at least over here. I have seen some POE cycle stuff where the 'welded' seams pulled apart in your hands - really disappointing.

And last month I used the 'snozzle' pump bag from Exped and it blew its seams after about five days. However, the urethane glue that came in the repair kit with it completely sealed it all again within a few hours.

One thing I wasn't expecting was the height of the inflatable pads, which pushes your face even closer to the inner tent if there is any kind of slope at the back!

4:04 p.m. on May 2, 2012 (EDT)
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gonzan said:

I think Callahan was wondering if there was a shorter version (there are three sizes) and if you received one. I thought the same thing, but I looked up the sizes and saw none were close to what you got. 

I think just swap it out for a non-defective one at the retailer, or call cascade designs. One or both of them will replace it with the proper size. 

 YEp, you got it.

I say return it for another Therm-A-Rest.

Of correct size.

5:49 p.m. on May 2, 2012 (EDT)
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Callahan said:

gonzan said:

I think Callahan was wondering if there was a shorter version (there are three sizes) and if you received one. I thought the same thing, but I looked up the sizes and saw none were close to what you got. 

I think just swap it out for a non-defective one at the retailer, or call cascade designs. One or both of them will replace it with the proper size. 

 YEp, you got it.

I say return it for another Therm-A-Rest.

Of correct size.

 That's what bothers me, to go in town spend 6 dollars for transportation and 2 hours. I contact them by email, at he very beginning of this week and still have no answer.

6:11 p.m. on May 2, 2012 (EDT)
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This got me really thinking...

I spent some time looking at the pattern and the ThermA Rest printed name. There is something odd there.

 First 4" (10cm) cannot be a manufacturing mistake, it looks deliberate. If you look at those diamonds , the ones in the center are at the center and the ones at the end also are shaped as they are in the "correct" mat. Now, I doubt very much that all "72" mats are 68" because if they were I would have seen that posted in some forums (I spend a considerable amount of time reading forum posts...)

Brumo, can you please take a picture of only say the last quarter of the mat showing the brand ?

(unfortunately even the press shots from TR are crap...hard to see details on 4mb plus shots (!))

Franco

Update

I received a reply from Cascade Designs inc this line

"The pads are supposed to measure 72 inches but we’re finding out there may have been a few cut short."

and yes they had received a similar comment from another guy recently.

I think I know who that was.

Still can't figure out how that happens, maybe the cutting part is a rotary device and it has to do with speed ..

Or it is a thermarest" not a Therm A Rest" the way parmesan is not Parmesan...9that is why I was intersted in a close up of the lettering)

 

 

10:24 p.m. on May 2, 2012 (EDT)
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Can't you find someone 5'8" tall and give it to them. I am always upset I have to carry 3 more inches than I need. I bet someone out there would be stoked to get that pad.

10:49 p.m. on May 2, 2012 (EDT)
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Franco said:

This got me really thinking...

I spent some time looking at the pattern and the ThermA Rest printed name. There is something odd there.

 First 4" (10cm) cannot be a manufacturing mistake, it looks deliberate. If you look at those diamonds , the ones in the center are at the center and the ones at the end also are shaped as they are in the "correct" mat. Now, I doubt very much that all "72" mats are 68" because if they were I would have seen that posted in some forums (I spend a considerable amount of time reading forum posts...)

Brumo, can you please take a picture of only say the last quarter of the mat showing the brand ?

(unfortunately even the press shots from TR are crap...hard to see details on 4mb plus shots (!))

Franco

Update

I received a reply from Cascade Designs inc this line

"The pads are supposed to measure 72 inches but we’re finding out there may have been a few cut short."

and yes they had received a similar comment from another guy recently.

I think I know who that was.

Still can't figure out how that happens, maybe the cutting part is a rotary device and it has to do with speed ..

Or it is a thermarest" not a Therm A Rest" the way parmesan is not Parmesan...9that is why I was intersted in a close up of the lettering)

 

 

 

:D. The last part of the mat are symmetrical, both end are of the same length. I will measureit  that and give you some pictures.

You are more lucky than I am. They responded to you right away. I'm waiting for 3 days. Ho I just get an answer. They will investigate and ask me if i want something like a platypus bottle to cover my gas and parking fees.

The consumers on the french website measured their solite and solar :

1 solite 68 inches (mine),

1 solite 69 inches,

2 solar 70 inches,

1 solite 71 inches,

1 solar large 79.5 inches.

They don't care though as they are UL backpacker.

11:57 p.m. on May 2, 2012 (EDT)
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hi Brumo

I happen to be exactly 68" tall...but I don't want you mat.

There are some minor details that  bug me, for example the s in Rest as well as the M in Therma, but I am probably seeing something that is not there.

Anyway if you can take extra shots I will apriciate that and then I will have to go to town to have a look...

I like going to town anyway because it reminds me of why I don't go to town.

Franco

3:32 a.m. on May 3, 2012 (EDT)
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Brumo said:

Callahan said:

gonzan said:

I think Callahan was wondering if there was a shorter version (there are three sizes) and if you received one. I thought the same thing, but I looked up the sizes and saw none were close to what you got. 

I think just swap it out for a non-defective one at the retailer, or call cascade designs. One or both of them will replace it with the proper size. 

 YEp, you got it.

I say return it for another Therm-A-Rest.

Of correct size.

 That's what bothers me, to go in town spend 6 dollars for transportation and 2 hours. I contact them by email, at he very beginning of this week and still have no answer.

 call cascade design.  I have several times, for assistance on several of the many brands that they sell.  Nearly always sensible, excellent service. 

10:22 a.m. on May 3, 2012 (EDT)
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Hmmm ....

This post has prompted me to check the measurements of two Thermo-Rest pads I just got (last week).

I got the NeoAir XLite pads, one in the 'regular' length (published 72"), and one in the 'short' length (published 48").

Scandalously expensive, but, the 'regular' length one is exactly 1/2 the weight of my Nemo Astro insulated (for Winter use) pad, which I won't need for another 6-months or so.   I feel the Nemo pads are quite a bargain, in comparison cost-wise, and I am pleased with the performance.

Soooo ... I just unboxed both the Thermo-Rest pads for the first time.

BINGO!   Right on the money.   Both of them, as published.   Good.   Because I also got a couple of the Thermo-Rest Trek & Travel fitted-sheets.

                               ~ r2 ~

10:53 a.m. on May 3, 2012 (EDT)
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I think I discovered the reason. It is due to the ridges. It makes the ridgerest acting like a spring. So it can stretches a lot or contract a lot.

All user that have a short length issue have a brand new RR. The older version were all of the good length or longer which seems logical. I tried to stretch mine tonight and My RR is now 70 inches. I'll try to stretch it a little more.

That's good to know. 

7:10 p.m. on May 3, 2012 (EDT)
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Hi Brumo

One guy at BPL mentioned heat, it strtches when warm.

Not sure about 4" but you are already half a way there.

Might be that "solar" coating that does that...

Franco

7:36 p.m. on May 3, 2012 (EDT)
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Franco said:

Hi Brumo

One guy at BPL mentioned heat, it strtches when warm.

Not sure about 4" but you are already half a way there.

Might be that "solar" coating that does that...

Franco

 I'm planning to use by cold temp.

TAR is still investigating.

9:58 p.m. on May 5, 2012 (EDT)
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Finally, I return the RR solite at the shop for an exchange. The all batch were too short. We measure all of them. I then measured the RR solite large. 77inches instead of 76. Which is normal. So i bought the large and i will trim it.

The shop will return the all batch to cascade designs.

Bottom line : If possible always measure and weight what you buy

1:47 p.m. on May 6, 2012 (EDT)
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Glad to hear that you are now sorted

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