internal vs external frame packs

I've been giving some thought to replacing my trusty old Kelty external frame pack with something more comfortable (like an Arcteryx Bora 80 or equivalent).

The Kelty sure isn't comfortable, even with the "upgraded" waist belt (it doesn't really 'wrap around' in the way the newer ones do). But I do like the "coolness" (air flow) of the external frame pack, and the rigidity with a heavy load, and the ease with which things (like my sleeping pad & tripod) can be lashed on. I'm not sure how well that would work with the internal frame packs (I don't want the tripod swaying in the breeze)

But I like the "compactness" (better center of gravity) of the newer internal frame packs (it would have come in handy during several scrambles last week, when the D4 felt unwieldy). I also like the fancy new suspension systems which promise to be much more comfortable than the D4.

So I'm still on the fence on this one... maybe I'll see if I can rent a pack for a weekend trip - though the idea of packing with a pack soaked with someone else's sweat doesn't really appeal to me :).

Take a look at the Ospreys with the mesh standoff on the back. They offer a lot of the best features of both internal and external - lots of ventilation, as much as an external, but narrower and more maneuverable like internals. Mystery Ranch also has some packs that are better ventilated than most internals.

When on expeditions, using my Terraplane, I put the tripod in the side tensioners with the feet in the stake/tent pole/ski pole/etc pocket. That's a feature of most expedition internals that you should look for.

Bill, thanks for the suggestion - I'll check into Osprey.

What you suggested for the tripod is exactly what I do with my day pack (Kelty Redwing 3100). That works out great.

Do you just strap your sleeping pad on using the loops that typically run down the back of the pack?

Unlike most people, I prefer the external frame packs (at least among all the packs that I have tried). I currently use a Jansport Carson, and like it.

Quote:

Unlike most people, I prefer the external frame packs
(at least among all the packs that I have tried). I
currently use a Jansport Carson, and like it.

Funny you should mention that. Back when I bought the Kelty D4, I really had my heart set on what was then the current Jansport frame pack. I loved (and still love) how those back panels zipped out, rather than being a top-loading design like the Kelty.

But, given my age at the time, Dad had the final say, and being an engineer, he was all over that Kelty with the "it'll last a lifetime" frame, vs the Jansport, which at the time had somewhat dubious looking frame joints.

Alas, he was right, at least in terms of the "last a lifetime" part ... "hey, who cares if it's comfortable, if it'll last a lifetime" :-)

Sleeping pad? We don' use no stinkin' sleepin' pad! How else can I get the weight down?

On my expedition packs, I put the inflatable (3/4 length) in the sleeping bag compartment with the sleeping bag. The closed cell foam goes under the pack lid or attached to the bottom with the bottom compression straps (for winter, Alaska Range, Antarctica, you use both, stacked). People with the Z-Rest type mostly stack it under the pack lid.

In summer, when light-packing, the inflatable is left at home (a 3/4 length is over 1.5 pound, with full-length ones getting up to 2 pounds or more, vs the closed cell foam and unde a half pound). The foam then goes on as before (my lighter summer internal packs don't have sleeping bag compartments).

BH, A couple of thoughts about the Bora 80:
Extremely well made, very rugged and lots of everything on it. The downside is it is heavy, costs a fortune and I found the belt to be too stiff for me to be comfortable. I got rid of mine after just one trip. At almost $400 retail (which fortunately I didn't pay), don't make that mistake.

I now have a Kelty Flight (discontinued). I think it was a cheaper version of the Cloud, their white Kevlar pack. For me, the key is something that fits. I got my Kelty used at a great price and it is very comfortable. It has interchangeable belts, straps and all that too, so it is pretty versatile.

I am thin, so something like my Kelty, as well as Osprey or Granite Gear packs, which I have only tried on in the store, seem to fit me right.

If you still want a frame pack, look at LuxuryLite. They look strange-like a packframe with 3 duffle bags of various sizes stacked on it, but the people who have them, really like them.

If I was looking, I would head for a big store like REI and trying on everything they have; a lot depends on your body and not all packs, regardless of price or quality, are going to work for you.

Thanks, Bill S and Tom, these are good tips.

I checked out the Osprey Crescent 85 at REI this afternoon. It seems to be right on target for what I'd want. Like the Bora 80, though, it's very expensive. It's about 12 oz lighter than the Bora, so it's still fairly heavy. The only thing I didn't like is the back pocket is mostly open, so it would be exposed to the elements, and probably fill up with rain or snow. And the side opening to the internal compartment is pretty small. But I haven't really seen one with the full rear opening I like, like my Kelty Redwing 3100 has. I like how the Crescent has strap points on the top of the pack - good for a sleeping pad - and there's a mesh pocket and side straps which would work nicely for my tripod, also as on the Redwing. The "frame" seems to be structured such that it would hold heavy loads well, without bending or sagging like some of the others.

Anyway, my boots are my first priority - they're a "must do", since they make my feet hurt. The pack is something I'll explore for a while - I can use the old Kelty until if/when I find exactly what I'm looking for - the right combination of comfort and usability.

bheiser here's another vote for Osprey - I use a 2003 Osprey Aether 60 (slightly lighter & nicer side pockets than the current Aether 60).

It weighs slightly less than 3lbs; I could have gone lighter, but I'll put my pack's durability up against any other 3-4lb pack - important to me as I mainly backpack offtrail & tend to prefer simple, durable stuff.

Bottom line is, just like boots, you need to try a few on & see how they work for you.