UL trip - Tom D, Bill S

11:39 p.m. on September 3, 2004 (EDT)
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749 forum posts

I am planning my so far ultimate UL trip for Sept 25 & 26 to Duck Lake - above Angels Camp on hwy 4 [Sierras]. I haven't been there since the big fire swept through a year ago, but someone told me they were there and the lake area is ok - thank goodness - it preserves a rare piece of riparian ecology up in an otherwise dry barren land, including the rare Yosemite Toad.
So maybe Bill or Tom would want to join me. Tom you could fly to SF maybe Friday night...
So to keep this of interest, heres my list - ha ha:

food/paper towels
camera 6
baseball cap
red flannel shirt
sun glasses/glasses 2.75
fleece jacket
monte bell longies
warm hat
ti pan and cup medium
Iroquois bag stuffed
air mattress
golite pack
plastic sheet
first aid
insect stick
toothpaste, etc sunlotion
gerber knife
foam sit pad in pack
Including the 6 ounce hp camera it weighs 10.25 pounds, not including the clothes I wear, nor food nor water.
Jim S

1:15 p.m. on September 4, 2004 (EDT)
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1,902 forum posts

Jim, not sure yet-I'll email you more or call you.

2:19 p.m. on September 5, 2004 (EDT)
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Now is not a good time to consider a backpack trip. My friend Richard talked me into joining him on a "little dayhike" yesterday. It was just a little "loop hike" from Saratoga Gap to Saratoga Gap. Turned out to be a rather warm, dry day - something like 90-100F, 20 percent and lower humidity all day. Thankfully mostly under the redwoods. And only 32 miles and 5300 ft of elevation gain.

I took a light pack, except for the water. I borrowed Barbara's 100 ounce hydrater. We had only one refill location, about 8 miles into the hike. By that point I had consumed about 1 liter of Hydrolite. I refilled, and by the 22 mile mark had consumed all 3 liters (4 liters total). I did have a small 1/2 liter bottle, plus one of the guys had packed several extra liters and gave me one. By the 29 mile mark, with another 1200 feet to climb, I finished all that.

I'm a bit on the tired side, having started by lugging 6 pounds of water. The first third of the hike was downhill, followed by 1000 ft of gain, followed by 1000 ft of downhill, followed by climbing for the last 10 miles. We went through 7 parks (it's called the "Seven Parks Hike"). Took a little under 13 hours for a 2 and a half mph average. I guess you could say we averaged 400 ft/hr altitude gain, but half the trip was downhill, so maybe it was 800 ft/hr?? Except that the 100 deg climb sections were pretty slow.

I guess I did ok for an Old Greybeard.

After I rest for a couple weeks, I might consider a backpack. Except that I have a climbing trip to Gianelli Edges next weekend, then later in the month, I will be doing a big wall climb.

5:48 p.m. on September 5, 2004 (EDT)

32 miles, 5300 feet of elevation gain/loss, and just under 13 hours with limited hydration? I say you're full of shit old dude!

1:52 p.m. on September 6, 2004 (EDT)
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Check it out yourself

I agree that I had less water than I should have (total of about 5 liters for the 12h45m on a 90+F day), but that's what was available with a 3 liter hydration bladder and the one place you could get a refill.

As for the hike distance and elevation gain, you can see the hike description on the Day Hiking activities page of the Loma Prieta Chapter of the Sierra Club - 7 Parks hike for Septembre 4, at this URL - http://lomaprieta.sierraclub.org/calendar.html#dh , but in case you are too lazy to read go to that URL, a copy and paste version is below. The Day Hikes section does several hikes like this every year. There are lots of people who do this type of hike all the time. Try it - you might even like it (though with your attitude, I suspect a 5 mile hike with no elevation gain on a 60 degF day might be beyond you).

Day Hiking

All hikes by the Day Hiking Section are open to the general public

10:35 p.m. on September 6, 2004 (EDT)
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98 forum posts


Lot's of folks on the internet are full of it. Personally my eyes are very, very brown.

Maybe you intended your comment as some kind of wry witticism, but, if not, I think you picked the wrong guy when you called bullshit on Bill S. I haven't met the man, but based on watching him interact with other folks on the web (those he's actually hooked up with for hikes and climbs and those whom he's helped with information and advice), I think I can say with confidence that this is one guy who has no need or desire to bullshit.

A person with courage might consider an apology appropriate right about now.

12:26 p.m. on September 7, 2004 (EDT)

Second tokyo bill's comments

sdc -

I agree with tokyo bill's comments. I think you are out of line. Bill S has contributed a lot of excellent stuff here. If you look through this forum you would see that. I'm one of the people who has hiked with him, and i can testify that he outhiked several of us who were at least 20 years younger than him. and I have hiked with the day hike group he went with, except on one of their short hikes which was 17 miles. They do long hikes like that all the time. And I agree with tokyo bill that if you had any guts you would apologize.

1:59 p.m. on September 7, 2004 (EDT)
346 reviewer rep
982 forum posts

Your comments are totally uncalled for. Bill is one of the straightest shooters you're likely to meet, online or on the trail. Take the time to read some the great information he's shared here over the years; I'm sure you'll learn a thing or two.

3:29 p.m. on September 7, 2004 (EDT)

Never doubt a wise man

The older I get, the more I realize that there are plenty of persons both male and female, younger and older that are far smarter, far faster, far stronger and will no doubt accomplish far more in their lifetimes than I could ever dream. That admission by no means makes me feel uneducated, weak, small , ineffective or less important of a person.
Someone far wiser than I once told me,

11:46 p.m. on September 9, 2004 (EDT)
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749 forum posts
Bill S - worn out - hurricanes

Well Bill - heres some kind words, some deleted words, some othere deleted stuff, mention of being dragged up a mountain, etc... (;->)

I'm sorry that you can't make it though. I think my buddy from San Salvador - Fito will come along, and one never knows what Tom D might do in the last minute. Still I will be carrying the 14 ounce golite pack and a base back of ten pounds including my new hp camera. I think this will be the last weekend of the season before changing to a heavier sleeping bag, bigger pack, more serious shelter, hotter stove, etc.

I went up to Kings Canyon one summer - 1988 and we hiked up to Vidette Meadow by the JMT 9,600'. Did I mention crawling with bears? Anyway my buddy who was from New York City freaked at the bears and made me hike out to Cedar Grove in Kings Canyon Nat'l Park and drive home the next day while he passed out in my truck. Anyway the descent was about 26 miles closest I can figure, and from 9,600' to 5,000', nearly a mile of elevation loss. We did that in one day AND drove back to San Francisco. The last 6 miles I just cruised without a stop.
Jim (:->)

11:54 p.m. on September 9, 2004 (EDT)
37 reviewer rep
749 forum posts

Hey Bill S
oops forgot to ask - with Dave's kind permission I'll just sneak this post in here...
(You see I just happen know that Bill's a meteorology expert - see? And I can't even spell it!)

Hey so theres this third really big Hurricane and I understand this is a really biggy, like a 5 on a scale of 5, whats the deal? This is an extremely rare event to have three such large hurricanes in a row, in fact its never happened in recorded history and it was 1964 the last time one this big hit. Will there be more? Have ocean currents warmed too? I know hurricanes work off rising water vapor in the Atlantic - is the global warming causing this? Is this a portent of future weather? How will this affect camping in Florida?????
Jim S

11:06 a.m. on September 13, 2004 (EDT)
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Re: Hurricanes

No, I am not a meteorology expert. That's my Young Son, the Atmospheric Scientist. It happens that his grad school advisor is one of the guys who has been quoted in the news about hurricane seasons. The word actually is that this season will have *fewer* "named storms" than average, with 4 or 5 being hurricanes. I'm not sure where you got the thing about "never before" were there 3 big hurricanes hitting Florida, but in the 1920s and 1930s there were a couple years where 3 or 4 huge hurricanes hit Florida. There also have been years where 3 or 4 huge hurricanes hit, but at various places in the Gulf, not just Florida. Shortly before we moved to Mississippi, there was Camille (MS/AL Gulf coast), one on Texas Gulf Coast, and one in FL. There have also been spells of typhoons (Western Pacific name for the same kind of storm). Yes, it is rare, but not unheard of.

William's thesis (which I haven't finished reading) is about the influence of Saharan dust storms on hurricanes in the Gulf/Carribean. Seems the dust storms provide the condensation centers for the vapor (water vapor needs condensation centers, like dust particles, to condense as droplets) and may help drive the initiation of storms that become hurricanes.

Camping in Florida? No one camps in Florida. Too hot and humid, even in a hammock. And besides, the gators will eat you, after the watermoccasins have bit you.

1:38 p.m. on September 13, 2004 (EDT)
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1,261 forum posts
yea darn it, those gators are absolutely everywhere...

had one in the toilet looking up at me when I went in to pee.

May 25, 2018
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